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She's seen a lot of reviews and stuff saying they're good around kids... but never to leave them with kids unsupervised, like you can with Goldens and Labs. There's also the issue of them not playing or living peacefully with other dogs and animals. That'd be an issue if we tried to leave it with my parents and their dog when we went on trips. It's really hard to separate truth from anecdotal horror stories with this breed. ? I noticed this when looking more into the both the Rough Coat Border Collie and the Smooth Coat Border Collie. From what I can tell, even though Smooth Coats have much shorter hair, they actually shed more than Rough Coat Border Collies. I remember that our Rotties would shed and leave black hair all along the walls if we didn't brush them in the backyard at least once weekly. But we never really had to clean, "comb" or groom their coat. I think if we had to choose one, Wifeshift would definitely go for the less shedding because it'll mean a marginally cleaner house. We do have a pair of Roombas and no carpet, but as any pet owner knows, hair can get anywhere and everywhere...

Or he just sucks at obedience training. I kid, I kid... I've been trying to get more out of her on what she would want from her dog on a daily basis, and one thing she said is that she basically wanted a couch dog that she could snuggle up with on the couch. Another reason she doesn't want it to be too big. Looking into more temperaments, she's actually intrigued by both American Pit Bull Terriers, but probably more by the American Stratfordshire Terrier because most people aren't afraid only of its name. I started having her look into PIts and Am Staffs due to Matt's [now deleted] endorsing comments on his dogs and also her sister saying that a Pit would be really good with our niece if they came to visit, saying they're one of the best breeds around children. "Nanny dogs". They seem to check a lot of the boxes but she's still unsure due to their reputation as "natural bred killers" and the fact that they're straight up banned in certain US cities and even entire modern Western countries. I have a friend who has at least three Pits, so we might go visit so she can socialize with them and see how she likes the breed in person.

So Airedales can't be trained to not bite?

This is precisely what I *don't* want in a dog and why I lean towards larger guard dogs and working dogs. But like... there are TONS of different types of Terriers. Thery're not all like this are they?

So did American Pit Bull Terriers inherit their ancestral Terrier asshole...ish...ness?

We're both kind of leaning away from Beagles a bit now. Their temperament doesn't really match what either of us are looking for. She was looking into both Springer Spaniels and Border Collies, but only the Smooth Coat Border Collies to avoid the heaving shedding and grooming needs of the showdog variant of the breed. I really like the idea of a Border Collie but as premier herding dogs, they have no issue running a good half mile away from you across a pasture to flank herds and therefore are kind of the opposite of personal protection dogs like Dobermans. Of course, then Wifeshift found the Doberman Collie, the hybrid of the Doberman Pincher and Border Collie: Thing with this hybrid breed appears to be that they're harder to socialize to strangers, and they're also nearly as big as a Doberman anyway, just a little shorter and not as lanky. A good bit bigger than the Beagleman, but the same issue where there might not be many, or any in shelters. Still, this is a mix of arguably two of the smartest breeds on the planet, and probably one of the most energetic breeds period.

She doesn't really *want* any dog at all. It's like when we went out to buy my Nissan sports car years ago, before we were married. I asked her if she liked the car. She stared at me with this "I don't want to say what I'm thinking face" for a good 15 seconds and then said, "I like that you like it..." She may think she hates big dogs, but she knows that getting a dog is what I want most in life right now, and something I've wanted since before we met. So if we do end up getting a dog, she thinks she's going to hate being a dog owner and will only be doing so for my sake (I know she'll love the dog tho). Problem is, it won't be like my car where all she has to do is walk around it to her own car every so often and doesn't ever have to deal with driving it, parking it, getting gas, changing oil, doing repairs or anything. This dog will depend on her as much as on me, probably moreso since she's going to be at home twice as much as I will be for the foreseeable future. Therefore, in her eyes this dog ownership stint has to go as perfectly as possible and that means planning for the long run. She wants the dog to be trained as well as possible to be as socialized and obedient as possible from as early an age as possible. And that means a puppy. Wifeshift doesn't half ass anything or cut corners. Even if she hates doing something, she'll dedicate the time and effort to do it right the first time.

If we did that, I'm pretty sure her parents and sister would never come visit us ever again...

Looking into shelter dogs, turns out Wifeshift wants a puppy from a breeder. Bad experiences with dogs having unknown health defects due to its breeding history, temperamental issues from early life traumas, etc. Pretty sure my parents dog has something to do with that. Their dog was 9 months old when rescued and due to something with her previous owner, anyone with a hat on in the house or a beard longer than a full inch basically faces persistent hostility. She's been doing her own research though and because I like Dobermans, she was looking into a Beagleman / Dobeagle. A Beagle + Doberman Pinscher mix: They seem to vary widely in physical traits and coloration, but Wifeshift likes the way all the variants look. My only concern is that everyone I've talked to about Beagles say that they're hard to train since they're not as bright as other breeds like Border Collies, Poodles, Dobermans and Labs. They also warn that they were bred as hunting dogs that are prone to run... and keep running. I guess this is a newer breed so they're not too prevalent in shelters and it's also very hard to find information on the temperament traits they get from their Beagle lineage.

Y tho

I lock my car even in ritzy neighborhoods. I'm just an overly protective person in general, always have been. Little sisters, younger cousins and neighbors, premie niece, etc. I want my dog to reflect my protective nature and be physically capable of backing up their bark.

Cool, good to have validation on that. I'd be fine with a smaller dog in addition to a big guard dog as long as it's not a little yappy rat dog like my Grandmother's old Shit-Zoo. Like a Min Pin mite.b.cool. We've been looking into a few breeds for details on behavior, instincts, temperament, etc. Unfortunately, Wifeshift never met Kerbey, so she doesn't want a Corgi. The Australian Cattle Dog / Blue Heeler and Border Collie were two we were looking into, but they both seem to be "too smart" for new owners. I'm hearing that if they aren't adequately stimulated both physically and intellectually, they act out and start destroying your house, chewing up all your shit, etc. I personally wouldn't mind the challenge, but I have to make sure Wifeshift has a good first experience here. So I don't listen to her much, but from what I gathered from tuning in and out during our last conversation, this is Wifeshift's current list of requirements for a dog: Not big, under 50lbs Doesn't drool Minimal to no shedding Minimal to no grooming needed Does NOT excessively yap or bark Able to go on walks, runs and outdoor hikes Good with small kids (4 year old niece, any future babbies) Good with other pets (parent's dog) Able to be trained to obedience It's unfortunate because other than that top requirement of not being a big dog, my Doberman would be a perfect candidate. I don't generally think of Goldens as protective, in the sense that they're not intimidating deterrents. The main benefit of a big guard dog for me is knowing that it's at the house keeping vigilant watch while she's there without me, or if she goes on walks out at night, etc. A dog that will deter anyone from approaching the house doors, or from approaching Wifeshift at all while she's out in public with it. A black lab might have that effect, but not a Golden.

Long story: Short Story: The issue is that I want a big dog that is well trained and can actually guard the house and protect Wifeshift if she takes it for walks at night, and she would want a small lapdog that can sit on her lap while she watches TV or reads or whatever. Should we compromise and get a medium size dog that might be too big for her but too small for me, or do we get two dogs at the same time?